Tannehill comes up short?

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Tannehill comes up short?

Post by mercury22nathan on Tue Sep 13, 2016 9:58 am

let me start this off by saying, I WANT RYAN TANNEHILL to be the answer. to be the great (or even very good) QB the Phins have so sorely lacked since Marino's retirement. and while he has teased with occasional excellent moments (and even a game here and there), he has not convincingly made the case that he is the one to lead Miami back to relevance (much less playoff victories). and so this is why it puzzles me to read things like the following:

The offense, meanwhile, found its leader in Tannehill. The Dolphins quarterback merely had perhaps his finest career moment in leading an 86-yard drive for what might have been the winning score in the final seven minutes.

http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/2016/09/seahawks-find-a-way-to-win-beat-dolphins-12-10.html

But Tannehill was money when it mattered in the fourth quarter when he produced an 86-yard drive that produced the go-ahead touchdown. To do that in Seattle is impressive. The Dolphins lost because the defense didn't hold late, but Tannehill showed growth with a potentially clutch drive.

http://www.espn.com/blog/miami-dolphins/post/_/id/22765/defensive-line-ryan-tannehills-stock-rising-with-dolphins

Tannehill is doing his part. But the Dolphins’ wide receivers and tight ends must be better.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/miami-dolphins/sfl-perkins-dolphins-wrs-tes-must-be-better-commentary-20160912-story.html

did Tannehill really play that great in Seattle? obviously his 16 of 29 for 186 with no TDs is pretty pedestrian. and yes, he did have that one potential TD pass dropped by Stills - but that is one pass...that accurately traveled a decent distance through the air. Tannehill's longest pass of the day, a 50-yarder to Foster, actually was thrown 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage with Foster doing all the work. and that go ahead drive, the 2 big passes - a 28 yarder to Landry and 29 to Williams - traveled a combined 2 yards beyond the line of scrimmage with both the recipients gaining the vast majority of the ground covered.

and while yes, i recognize that a successful TD drive beats the alternative in that situation, i am just not sure Tannehill was the difference maker given the lack of distance the ball traveled through the air.


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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by JMP on Tue Sep 13, 2016 10:49 am

Interesting how everyone wants to kill Stills for dropping a pass, while very few people have called out Tannehill for missing an open Stills in the endzone.

On Sunday I saw pretty much the same Tannehill I've always seen: a guy that makes some plays, misses others and simply doesn't do enough to win games.  You can't sleepwalk for 3 1/2 quarters and count on a miracle 4th quarter comeback - there's way too much pressure placed on the entire team to make that happen.  Sooner or later, Tannehill needs to start playing better early in games, because this team just isn't built for 4th quarter comebacks.  I mean, 3 points in 3 1/2 quarters against Seattle?  Really?  Not going to win many games like that, and let's be honest - the Seahawk D is good, but it isn't that good. 

Tannehill continues to show horrible pocket awareness and movement, and he continues to have trouble identifying pressure pre-snap.  He also continues to get passes batted down at the line.  5 years into his career, I'm not sure we can expect any of those things to get better.

And you know, maybe Philbin and Lazor were onto something when they refused to give Tannehill more control over the offense.  Some people are saying that on Sunday's awful rushing attempt on 4th and inches, that Tannehill checked out of a QB sneak and instead called that absurd running play that was doomed to fail from the start.  If that is in fact true, it speaks volumes about Tannehill's grasp of the game.

Anyway, the bottom line is, Tannehill has been far too inconsistent to count on him as a gamechanger. 
He has shown no ability at all to lead his team to a winning season, and so far the early results in the new offense aren't encouraging.  And keep in mind - this "new" offense isn't all that different than the offense Tannehill ran under Lazor.  I sure hope he does a 180 and proves me wrong, but at this point I'm inclined to think that we already know what type of QB Tannehill is: a guy that puts up decent stats but doesn't win many games.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by white1 on Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:08 am

Good discussion and you are seeing the dichotomy that probably also exists in the Miami front office.

I will admit, I was encouraged by the drive he put together to score the go ahead touchdown, and in the 4th quarter where he has traditionally struggled.

As JMP says, there were other plays/drives where we just did nothing. Far too many three and outs. Tannehill has everything he needs to succeed, time to make this offense produce - now or never.

I will temper all of this with the advice from several of the Fins beat writers. It will take time for this offense to develop under Gase, and it will look ugly early in the season. We can all see what's happening on the field week to week, but it's going to take a full season before we can judge Tannehill in this offense against a meaningful sample size.

Have no fear. If January rolls around and his stats look like they do right now, I am going all in on calling for the Fins to dump him and plan on drafting a QB. In April 2017.

For right now? Remaining patient, as hard as that is.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by mercury22nathan on Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:36 am

JMP wrote:Some people are saying that on Sunday's awful rushing attempt on 4th and inches, that Tannehill checked out of a QB sneak and instead called that absurd running play that was doomed to fail from the start.  If that is in fact true, it speaks volumes about Tannehill's grasp of the game.

Gase says...

On going for it on fourth down: “We got kind of caught in something we planned on doing. Ryan saw something else. He had the right thought and it was one of those things he wasn’t sure how our guys would react. I put a lot of that on myself. I had a terrible formation for putting our tight ends in there. Our d-ends were able to crash down.”

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article101400132.html


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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by white1 on Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:40 am

Bad stuff happens in every game.

I have no problem with the decision to go for it. Didn't like the playcall, but everyone is an expert after the fact. That run works, it's the perfect call. Silly to debate when the play is over.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by JMP on Tue Sep 13, 2016 12:30 pm

white1 wrote:Bad stuff happens in every game.  

I have no problem with the decision to go for it.  Didn't like the playcall, but everyone is an expert after the fact.  That run works, it's the perfect call.  Silly to debate when the play is over.

Actually, I think it's a great point to debate. 

Sure, if the play works, it's a great call - but the goal in that situation should be to give yourself the best possible chance to get the first down.  Which play had a better chance of success in that situation, where the Phins needed abou 6 inches (at most) for a first down: a QB sneak or a handoff 5 yards behind the line of scrimmage?  This isn't hindsight..I called for a sneak the second I knew they were going for it.  The issue was further compounded by the snap coming with just 2 seconds left on the play-clock.  That type of play needs to be run immediately, regardless of what play you run.  Don't give the D time to plan.  Bottom line - everything about that play was a disaster, and it's up to the QB to get it right.  That was a major fail.

As for going for it in the first place...I'm fine with the aggressiveness.  Personally, in a road game where my team couldn't put any points on the board, I probably would have attempted the FG.  But again - I'm OK with going for it.  I just thought the play call was an absurdly bad decision by Tannehill.

Thankfully, it was week one against a non-conference team.  There's a lot of football left, and time for everyone to improve.  Sunday against the Pats will be a much bigger and more important test - let's see what happens.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by rightchea on Tue Sep 13, 2016 1:18 pm

I think that Tannehill did well and that pass was going to be hard to make. I not mad at Stills either for that pass in the TD but mad that he had it then couldn't bring it in. I know they will be practicing that all week next week.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by finfanatic on Tue Sep 13, 2016 4:06 pm

I am almost to the point of saying Dump Tannehill and look for someone new next season. Doughty???

Shocked

Inconsistent play from T-hill for sure. Of course, he was getting the slobbersnot pounded out of him too!

The right side of the O-line looked like absolute crapola. Juwan James needs a sound beating for this performance IMO. Followed by Bushrod.

I do not know what is up with Cameron, but sit his dumbarse on the bench and put in someone who gives a crap!

The D gave great effort, but the pass D is suspect and with no QB pressure, they will get eaten alive, like on the Seahawks final drive. Pitiful, just pitiful.

What is more concerning to me, was it looked like the Seahawks had the Phins gameplan in the first half. The Seahawks D did everything exactly right. Gase got abused by Carroll IMHO.

The very fact the game was that close either means the Phins are much better than I think they are...or the Seahawks are not nearly as good as I thought they were?

Maybe somewhere in the middle.

It is hard to make a judgement on the first game, but the loss was not nearly as hideous as I thought it was going to be.

Very Happy


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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by Degarmo on Tue Sep 13, 2016 5:25 pm

Temper it all with it being opening day against a very tough defense in one of least favorable stadiums in the league.

The offense looked like I thought it would. I think they're going to struggle for 4-6 weeks. Hell, my score prediction was Seattle 12 Miami 5. I almost got it right. Razz
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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by mercury22nathan on Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:28 am

And production on third downs?

“Horrendous,” Christensen said.

Here’s why: The Dolphins failed on 11 of 14 third-down chances Sunday.

“First and second down wasn’t good enough to keep third down shorter, and a couple we screwed up and didn’t make a catch, didn’t make a throw,” Christensen added. “The passing game is where we really broke down.”

Gase said the line did a “pretty good job,” adding: “I think that’s the least I’ve ever had my quarterback hit against these guys.”

http://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nfl/miami-dolphins/article102073177.html

with the combination of "didn't make the throw" and the line did a "pretty good job" if i didn't know better, its almost sounds like these guys are kind of pinning the problem of the passing game breaking down on Tannehill.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by JMP on Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:54 am

So far, every time I read/hear Christensen speak - I love it.  Seems like he doesn't use coach-speak and isn't trying to play games - he just says what he feels, whether it's positive or negative.  I think it's great to have a guy on the staff that is honest and tells it like it is, instead of all these "yes men" we typically have.  I have a feeling that Gase is going to become a real asshole if the losses start piling up -he seems to get very defensive - but maybe Christensen can help keep him in check.

As far as the passing game, I wish we'd ditch the dink and dunk and just let Tannehill start ripping the ball.  It may fail, but I'd rather go down fighting that watch this pussy offense continue to crawl along 3 yards at a time.  I know that's not how Gase operates, but I'm just sick of this crappy passing philosophy...we need to throw more intermediate and deep passes and stop with plays that start at or behind the line.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by finfanatic on Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:33 am

Agree 100%.

There was no way in heck that offensive scheme was going to succeed vs. the Seahwaks D IMO.

Pete Carroll outcoached Gase. Anyone wonder what Belicheck is going to do?

Let's hope the Phins are able to eke out a stinky but somewhat threatening ground game, or else this is going to be a disaster IMO.

And Tannehill...I am ALMOST ready to say ditch this experiment and move on to someone new next season. At some point, it ain't the Oline, the OCs, or the HCs...it is the QB.

I am gonna give this Tannehill-Gase combo until the BYE Week..then....


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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by finskev on Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:32 pm

I saw the Stills drop from another Angle on Gamepass and it shows him Looking up for the Ball and Just before the Ball got there he Dropped His Head and it hit his Fingertips. What is Point of Looking for the Ball but not watching it all the way until it hits You in the Hands. I finally had to Quit so I can start getting ready for this week. since I dropped Directv will be listening to the Game on Nfl Gamepass and I hear Cefalo is Terrible on Play by Play.

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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by Degarmo on Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:46 pm

Tannehill is better with the intermediate routes anyway, which is far better than dump offs.  I'd rather get 7-15 yards than 0-3 on a flipping pass.

Also, I'm giving the offense until Week 6 to get its shit together, because of the new offense, but that doesn't mean a free pass either.  They need to show incremental improvement each week. These first two defenses are tough to judge how far they've come to be honest, because of how early in the season it is and how early on it is for their development.  If we don't see a spark against the Browns, we may be in real trouble, again, for the 20th consecutive year, or something just as absurd.
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Re: Tannehill comes up short?

Post by white1 on Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:52 pm

Totally agree Degarmo.

Seahawks and Pats, both away, a tough opening stretch for sure. But I expect to see better 3rd down performance and more points scored against the Pats.

If the Browns game is another loss, and the offense continues to sputter, we have a problem.

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