Comparables To Tannehill

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Comparables To Tannehill

Post by DolFan 316 on Fri May 29, 2015 4:26 am

This attempts to compare Tannehill to other QBs in NFL history at the age and stage of career he's currently at. And the conclusion is...there's really no comparison out there. But at least the comments are interesting IMO.

http://www.footballperspective.com/comparables-to-ryan-tannehill/#more-25097

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Fri May 29, 2015 9:12 am

I think the current version of Alex Smith is probably the closest comparison for Tannehill right now.  A limited game manager that is generally smart with the football, disappears in big spots, and needs the players around him to make him better - unlike the league's better QBs, who are at their best in key situations and make the players around them better.  Maybe Tannehill can lead a team to the playoffs, though that hasn't been proven yet, but I just don't see him ever being a top-shelf championship QB.  Hope he proves me wrong, but so far he's been very average IMO.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by white1 on Fri May 29, 2015 9:26 am

Stats aside, I think Tannehill gets in general too much criticism and not enough praise.

One main point that is rarely brought up, in his short career he has notched some big wins.

He beat Luck in Indy. He destroyed the Rivers-led Chargers team. He handily beat Tom Brady and New England in week 1 last year.

Yes, I will agree, he has areas of his game where we need to see improvement. But he has demonstrated in FULL GAMES the ability to beat a quality opponent. Plus he hung more than enough points on Denver to earn that victory, we weren't fielding an NFL defense at the time, unfortunately.

My only point is - it's far too early to call the "peak" on this development, and to say he has not demonstrated a killer instinct or capability to win is not accurate. He has. We all want to see it more often. Consistency is always the key for younger players, and I for one believe he can get there.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Fri May 29, 2015 11:52 am

white1 wrote:
One main point that is rarely brought up, in his short career he has notched some big wins.

He beat Luck in Indy.  He destroyed the Rivers-led Chargers team.  He handily beat Tom Brady and New England in week 1 last year.

Yes, I will agree, he has areas of his game where we need to see improvement.  But he has demonstrated in FULL GAMES the ability to beat a quality opponent.  Plus he hung more than enough points on Denver to earn that victory, we weren't fielding an NFL defense at the time, unfortunately.

My only point is - it's far too early to call the "peak" on this development, and to say he has not demonstrated a killer instinct or capability to win is not accurate.  He has.  We all want to see it more often.  Consistency is always the key for younger players, and I for one believe he can get there.

You consider those "big wins"? Why? I would argue that the only big games Tannehill has played in his career so far are the Bills and Jets games at the end of the 2013 season, and the Patriots and Ravens games at the end of the 2014 season. He was absolutely terrible in all 4 of those games, barely leading his team to any points. A multitude of players and coaches can share some blame for those losses as well, but at the end of the day great QBs come up big in big spots - and Tannehill simply didn't.

As far as the Denver game, Tannehill was great in the first half and disappeared in the second half, doing absolutely nothing when all he needed were a few first downs in the 4th. That's been a common theme in Tannehill's career - he can't finish games and he can't finish seasons. When the games are big, he plays small.

I certainly agree that Tannehill may not have peaked yet, but this team has now been built for him to succeed and there are no more excuses. 2015 needs to be a GREAT season for Tannehill, not just another "meh" season. I'm praying that Tannehill has a monster season and puts all these threads to rest, but he's going to have to show it before I give him the benefit of the doubt.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JEGnj on Fri May 29, 2015 12:13 pm

My big problem is Tanne does not produce that next level of confidence in crunch time. I do realize that not many do but with the game on the line there are those QB's that you know the game slows down for and they will just methodically get the ball down field for the TD or FG. With Tanne we hope he will but we are more likely sitting back waiting for him to get sacked and fumble or throw a pick.
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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by white1 on Fri May 29, 2015 12:55 pm

JEG, no offense but this is exactly the kind of anecdote that is impossible to support, or refute, with factual data.

To recap my main critique, I see a lot of fans (on social media and message boards) bash his drawbacks, attribute any offensive problem to a Tannehill problem (including sacks, whether he had time to throw or not), and make excuses for his opponents in the games where he did play well, diminishing the importance of the wins he has secured for the team.

All those things in summation add up to an unfair and inaccurate representation of his performance.

I prefer to keep it black and white. He is #14 overall in QBR and I want to see that number improve to top 10. Obviously, in order to do that he will need to improve in key areas and we can all name a number of them. That's about the depth of analysis I am willing to support on Tannehill. The rest is a lot of conjecture and guesses as to what's behind the flaws we can see on game day.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Fri May 29, 2015 1:38 pm

white1 wrote:All those things in summation add up to an unfair and inaccurate representation of his performance.

I prefer to keep it black and white.  He is #14 overall in QBR and I want to see that number improve to top 10.  Obviously, in order to do that he will need to improve in key areas and we can all name a number of them.  That's about the depth of analysis I am willing to support on Tannehill.  The rest is a lot of conjecture and guesses as to what's behind the flaws we can see on game day.

I don't know that it's inaccurate or unfair to call Tannehill "average". That's exactly what he's been in terms of stats and win-loss record. If anything, he's below average in several key areas, finishing near the bottom the league last season in deep passes and red zone, 3rd down and 4th quarter passing.

People want to point the finger at everyone but Tannehill, but I see guys like Andrew Luck and Russell Wilson dominating the league with less-than-stellar pieces around them. Sooner or later Tannehill needs to put on his big-boy pants and lead this team. He's going into his 4th season as a full-time starter...time to step up.

Like I said, this is the make or break season for Tannehill - I don't want to hear anymore excuses if he once again fails to lead this team to the playoffs.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by CarsonChris on Sun May 31, 2015 11:28 am

He makes me queasy on third down in the fourth quarter when the game is on the line!

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Tue Jun 02, 2015 6:54 am

I can't remember anyone besides me that hated the Tanehill pick. That being said I absolutely can't believe how well he's played given his lack of experience in college. I just don't understand how those who liked the pick expected more. Sure he needs to improve in some areas but the difference between Tannehill and QB's like Dalton, Smith and Kapernick is that he does show improvement every year.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:53 am

Birdmond wrote:I can't remember anyone besides me that hated the Tanehill pick. That being said I absolutely can't believe how well he's played given his lack of experience in college.  I just don't understand how those who liked the pick expected more.   Sure he needs to improve in some areas but the difference between Tannehill and QB's like Dalton, Smith and Kapernick is that he does show improvement every year.  

I liked the pick because I expected Tannehill to be a very good, maybe even great, QB. So far, he's been average at best, and I see some things that make me think he'll never be more than that - lack of pocket presence, poor ball placement, lack of leadership ability, inability to step up in big moments, etc. Fact is, he's not half the QB that Dalton, Smith and Kap are yet - because those guys win. Tannehill is below .500 in three full years as a starter. No way to sugarcoat that...you are what your record says you are, as Parcells always said.

The lack of experience in college is a dead issue...he's had three full seasons as an NFL starter, and that's no longer a valid excuse. It's time for him to take the next step this season, that's all there is to it. Stop being just a compiler of decent stats, and start being a winner.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:27 am

Based on what you saw in college from Tannehill it absolutely baffles me that anyone would expect him to be great. I can't find any college video that even hints at greatness.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:07 am

Birdmond wrote:Based on what you saw in college from Tannehill it absolutely baffles me that anyone would expect him to be great.   I can't find any college video that even hints at greatness.  

I thought Tannehill had a very high ceiling that he wasn't close to reaching in college. My mistake was that the ceiling, apparently, is much lower than I thought, and maybe what I saw in college was closer to what he will always be. I thought some NFL seasoning would clean up his problem areas and further his development, but that hasn't been the case - at least not to any great extent. He's definitely a starter and maybe one day he can be above average, but I don't see him ever lifting a Lombardi trophy. Hope I'm wrong, but I have to see some major development first.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Degarmo on Tue Jun 02, 2015 6:24 pm

I consider myself one of the very few that loved the Tannehill pick and still believe he could be great.

I'm happy with the constant improvement, but I seriously believe that he's been saddled with some really substandard coaches. I think this season will be the first time that he'll have an actual good receiving corps around him. Last year seemed good on paper, sort of, but it wasn't.

One thing we've lacked on this team is a bigger target. I think we may have a couple of those now, and if Sims keeps improving, he may be a great red zone weapon, particularly on the OFT FORGOTTEN FOR NO REASON AT ALL play action to the TE in the end zone.
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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Wed Jun 03, 2015 6:43 am

Well yeah. It seems most of us have no confidence in the coaches, offensive line and in previous years playmakers, but we still think Tannehill should win. Can't have it both ways. I'm pleasantly surprised by Tannehill's development.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:24 am

The better QBs are able to rise above, and actually make the players around them better. Andrew Luck and Russell Wilson both have crap offensive lines and aren't loaded with offensive playmakers, yet they win 11+ games every season. With Tannehill, all I hear are excuses. It's time for results.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:22 am

Name some QB's with a garbage OL and a poor head coach who wins consistently. Indy counts for nothing because their division is garbage.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Wed Jun 03, 2015 11:08 am

I guess OL quality is a matter of opinion, but I think in recent years Rodgers, Wilson and Big Ben have won Super Bowls with poor OLs, and E. Manning, Brady, Flacco and Brees won Super Bowls with decent (at best) OLs. And you can discount Luck all you want, but he leads his team to 11 wins and the playoffs year after year with a crap OL.

As for head coaches, Philbin is one of the worst in the league IMO, so Tannehill definitely has that working against him.

Regardless, my point is that other QBs are able to rise above poor OLs to win. Tannehill apparently needs everything to be perfect around him.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by rightchea on Wed Jun 03, 2015 6:59 pm

JMP wrote:I guess OL quality is a matter of opinion, but I think in recent years Rodgers, Wilson and Big Ben have won Super Bowls with poor OLs, and E. Manning, Brady, Flacco and Brees won Super Bowls with decent (at best) OLs.  And you can discount Luck all you want, but he leads his team to 11 wins and the playoffs year after year with a crap OL.

As for head coaches, Philbin is one of the worst in the league IMO, so Tannehill definitely has that working against him.

Regardless, my point is that other QBs are able to rise above poor OLs to win.  Tannehill apparently needs everything to be perfect around him.

But can't count none of them since they all have good coaches

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:48 pm

rightchea wrote:But can't count none of them since they all have good coaches

Are those coaches good on their own, or are they good because they have good QBs? I guess that's like a "chicken or egg" question...

But again - you're proving my point that Tannehill needs everything to be perfect around him. And in today's NFL, there's really no such thing as "perfect".

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:19 am

I agree that elite top 5 QB's can pretty much overcome anything. For me if Tannehill is ever top 10 that's good enough for me. I'd still like to see what a great coach could do for Tannehill. Anyway, I'm pleased with Tannehill considering I thought he'd be out of the league by now. He's signed to an EXTREMELY team friendly deal so I think it's a great situation.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Degarmo on Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:40 pm

Birdmond wrote:I agree that elite top 5 QB's can pretty much overcome anything.   For me if Tannehill is ever top 10 that's good enough for me.   I'd still like to see what a great coach could do for Tannehill.  Anyway, I'm pleased with Tannehill considering I thought he'd be out of the league by now.  He's signed to an EXTREMELY team friendly deal so I think it's a great situation.  

I agree completely.
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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by CarsonChris on Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:25 pm

A chocolate bar on a warm sunny day. Melts in the heat of the moment.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by JMP on Thu Jun 04, 2015 10:11 pm

CarsonChris wrote:A chocolate bar on a warm sunny day. Melts in the heat of the moment.

LOL well said! In the 4 most important games of his career, Tannehill led his team to a total of just 3 TDs and 33 points (and was shut out in one of those games), to go along with 5 INTs. Until that changes, he's not the answer. You can't play your worst in the biggest games - that's completely unacceptable. Let's see how he does this season if he gets to play important games at the end...now that the offense has been completely revamped just for him, the excuses are over.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by Birdmond on Fri Jun 05, 2015 6:01 am

So I guess you guys aren't Dan Marino fans. How many times did Marino dominate at Buffalo when it counted? So, just to be clear, you're all saying those games were Marino's fault.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

Post by CarsonChris on Fri Jun 05, 2015 9:04 am

I don't think our mediocre record is all on Tannehill. I didn't think he had the right weapons. There's no excuse this year.

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Re: Comparables To Tannehill

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