Worse next season

So far Miami might be the only team in sport's history to trade and release all their players in a total rebuild than follow up the net season replacing most of the players and coaches again and could actually be worse.

Why do you think we'll be worse? Free agency doesn't start till March, and the draft isn't until late April. Those two things are months away and we have no idea what the roster will look like for the 2020 season.

Are you thinking that losing Chad O'Shea and Patrick Graham is going to make us worse??? We had one of the worst offenses and one of the worst defenses in the NFL with those guys calling the shots. Why do you think we'll be worse?

To be honest we don't know what the relationship with Flores or O'Shea or if he wanted to keep coaching. I haven't seen anyone go after him yet so I not so sure if it was a bad thing. Also it sounds like Flores is adding people that he wants behind him and that will work well with what he is trying to do.

As long as Grier and Flores doesn't jack up the off-season and also not overspend on below average players then I think that Miami will be okay.

The thing I like about Flores is he's not afraid to make a change when something isn't working. The OL sucked, the offense sucked, the defense sucked, the safeties sucked and our young QB never developed. Now all those coaches are gone. Works for me!

JMP wrote:The thing I like about Flores is he's not afraid to make a change when something isn't working.  The OL sucked, the offense sucked, the defense sucked, the safeties sucked and our young QB never developed.  Now all those coaches are gone.  Works for me!

Here's the thing though, does this team really draft and sign players suitable for Gailey's system when there's a good chance he won't be around in a season or two?

Also, if Flores can win 5 games with THIS bunch of bumblers, busts and bums, there's no WAY he'll win less next season. I'll even say that if he can't win 8 games next season MINIMUM, it'll mean Grier screwed up the offseason and needs to be fired.

Here's the thing though, does this team really draft and sign players suitable for Gailey's system when there's a good chance he won't be around in a season or two?

Good question. I'm hoping that Flores has the foresight and planning capability to install an offense he plans to run long-term.

Like we just saw with the defense: Graham leaves so we promote from within and plan to run the same defense in 2020.

If Gailey is here short-term that's fine. As long as we are grooming an OC to come up from within when he retires. Me? I'm hoping it's Fitzpatrick. He plays in 2020, then joins our staff as a QB coach in 2021. Give him 2 years, he'll be ready to run the offense and call plays. He has the leadership ability, work ethic and the intelligence to do it.

DolFan 316 wrote:Here's the thing though, does this team really draft and sign players suitable for Gailey's system when there's a good chance he won't be around in a season or two?

The good news is, Gailey's system is adaptable and it's something that many NFL teams run some version of. So it should be relatively easy to find another coach that uses similar terminology and calls similar plays. The Chiefs and Rams run a similar style of offense, for example.

DolFan 316 wrote:Also, if Flores can win 5 games with THIS bunch of bumblers, busts and bums, there's no WAY he'll win less next season. I'll even say that if he can't win 8 games next season MINIMUM, it'll mean Grier screwed up the offseason and needs to be fired.

I agree. It would be nearly impossible to field a worse roster than the Phins did in 2019. I expect a big jump in wins in 2020, and if not...there's a problem.

white1 wrote:If Gailey is here short-term that's fine.  As long as we are grooming an OC to come up from within when he retires.  Me? I'm hoping it's Fitzpatrick.  He plays in 2020, then joins our staff as a QB coach in 2021.  Give him 2 years, he'll be ready to run the offense and call plays.  He has the leadership ability, work ethic and the intelligence to do it.

I'm down with that Let's hope Flores and Fitz are as well!

Fitz says when he’s done playing he’s done with football. Wants time with his family says he owes them.

Just saying we were lucky to win 5 games against 4 equally bad teams. We could be worse next year.

JEGnj wrote:Just saying we were lucky to win 5 games against 4 equally bad teams. We could be worse next year.

We had the worst roster in the league and beat two playoff teams that were in must-win situations. The future is bright.

I'm hoping for a great draft and upswing just very leery and beaten down.

JMP wrote:We had the worst roster of any NFL team of the past 40 years and beat two playoff teams that were in must-win situations.  The future is bright.

Fixed it for you

JEGnj wrote:I'm hoping for a great draft and upswing just very leery and beaten down.

I understand completely. BTW how's that whole spending more time with your family and friends thing working out? You are doing that now, right? Lord knows I've had to get away for a while at times.

CarsonChris wrote:Fitz says when he’s done playing he’s done with football. Wants time with his family says he owes them.

Dude's got SEVEN kids!!! He owes his wife some solo childcare hours for sure!

JMP wrote:Dude's got SEVEN kids!!!  He owes his wife some solo childcare hours for sure!

SEVEN?!?! Seems to me he's been spending too MUCH time with the wife!

I've known families like this, with even more children, where the oldest one could legit be the parent of the youngest one. I even used to know one guy who was somehow younger than his own nephew

DolFan 316 wrote:

JMP wrote:Dude's got SEVEN kids!!!  He owes his wife some solo childcare hours for sure!

SEVEN?!?! Seems to me he's been spending too MUCH time with the wife!

I've known families like this, with even more children, where the oldest one could legit be the parent of the youngest one. I even used to know one guy who was somehow younger than his own nephew

LOL Definitely some unique family configurations out there!

I have never understood how you can predict next season based on last year, when the coaching staff is changing and the roster is gonna be much different...seeing as even established teams that do not have much coaching staff change and less roster change, can go from the playoffs to the basement the next year?

All the indicators are up for sure, but I can guarantee not EVERY CHANGE the Phins make this year, is gonna automatically be for the better. That would be even more of a shock than 5 wins this season IMO.

It's like trading Tunsil for picks. Yeah, draft picks are great, but they are a crapshoot. Are you gonna get a LT as good as, or better than Tunsil with the pick? We would like to hope, but the chances are HECK NO! Remember, if not for the bongmask video release, the Phins would not have had Tunsil anyway.

Anyway, I like how the team was playing at the end of the year. That was good coaching keeping the team playing hard when all they had to play for was pride. Flores has earned some leeway. And just like with Wannstedt and Mike Westhoff, the HC has the right to kick a guy to curb simply because he dislikes the guy. Even if Westhoff was a great special teams coach.

One note on 2019 - we could have a far worse draft position. We lost the Refskins game on a poorly called and executed two point conversion attempt, and we lost the Jets game on a terrible PI call. Those 2 wins move us to 7-9 and make it that much more difficult to get into position for Tua.

Next season is going to hinge on Grier and Flores solving problems. Our trenches aren’t good enough, we can’t run the ball, can’t pressure the QB enough and can’t stop the run well enough. Make progress in those areas and the record doesn’t matter. We need to see this team get out of the bottom rankings in key areas.

finfanatic wrote:I have never understood how you can predict next season based on last year, when the coaching staff is changing and the roster is gonna be much different...seeing as even established teams that do not have much coaching staff change and less roster change, can go from the playoffs to the basement the next year?

All the indicators are up for sure, but I can guarantee not EVERY CHANGE the Phins make this year, is gonna automatically be for the better. That would be even more of a shock than 5 wins this season IMO.

It's like trading Tunsil for picks. Yeah, draft picks are great, but they are a crapshoot. Are you gonna get a LT as good as, or better than Tunsil with the pick? We would like to hope, but the chances are HECK NO!  Remember, if not for the bongmask video release, the Phins would not have had Tunsil anyway.

Anyway, I like how the team was playing at the end of the year. That was good coaching keeping the team playing hard when all they had to play for was pride. Flores has earned some leeway. And just like with Wannstedt and Mike Westhoff, the HC has the right to kick a guy to curb simply because he dislikes the guy. Even if Westhoff was a great special teams coach.

We won 5 games with a horrifically bad roster...one of the worst rosters in history, maybe. It is reasonable to assume that the roster will be at least somewhat better in 2020. With that in mind, a 2020 season of more than 5 wins is to be expected. Of course that's not written in stone...anything can happen and we can't accurately predict. But given the information we do have, fielding a better team with a better record is a logical assumption.

As for Tunsil, we do not have to use the pick we got for him on a left tackle. In fact, left tackle may not even be a high priority long-term if we draft Tua. Bottom line is, we got a first for an overrated player that is soon to be vastly overpaid. Did anyone else see Tunsil get absolutely abused by Frank Clark last weekend? Frankly, it was an embarrassment for Tunsil and made me feel even better about the trade.

white1 wrote:
Next season is going to hinge on Grier and Flores solving problems. Our trenches aren’t good enough, we can’t run the ball, can’t pressure the QB enough and can’t stop the run well enough. Make progress in those areas and the record doesn’t matter. We need to see this team get out of the bottom rankings in key areas.

I agree in part - solving problems and making progress is key, but if it doesn't translate to the win column than we have a problem. Another 5-win season will not be progress, even if the team is better.

Don't remember who said it but half of Miami team were either undrafted players or players off of someone practice squad. For the fact that Miami won 5 game is a blessing. If Miami does worst then I would personally go down to Miami to remove everyone in the front office myself.