Combine thoughts

rightchea wrote:No one is saying that there not going to be injures but there is a time where injures hurt the team. for example Sam Bradford started every game from 2010 to 2012 was ding up and played horrible. QB rating in the low 50 and lower. 2013 played seven games. 2014 didn't play. traded to philly and played most of the season dinged up and was horrible.

Robert Griffin III did well one year got injured and hasn't been the same. From top 10 draft pick to backup.

Now like I said before I not a fan of missing out on players that can make Miami into a better team but at the same time I not sure if Tua is worth trading away a 1st round pick for him unless he looks mobile during pro day and not a stiff starch down shirt.

Tua is a better prospect than Bradford or RGIII ever were. No comparison.

Bottom line: the Miami Dolphins NEED a franchise-caliber QB. I know a lot of people would prefer to play it safe and draft a project at QB because they are afraid of injury, or even wait till next year and trade our entire draft for Lawrence. But you know what I'm afraid of? Having another garbage QB. I'd rather take a chance on an elite talent and fail, then take a chance on a flawed project and fail. If you play scared, you'll always lose. Stop worrying about things outside your control, and go for the gold!

Now, obviously if Tua isn't healthy and can't move at his Pro Day, of course that's a different story. But at this point, there is zero reason to think he won't look good in a controlled environment at Alabama.

DolFan 316 wrote:Can't be elite if you can't stay healthy for a full season ever. Just sayin'.

I'd rather not see this team waste a top 5 pick on the next Sam Bradford. Also I've learned from the Brees/Culpepper Fiasco that when it comes to QBs leg injuries > arm injuries.

Seems like the ATM (Anti-Tua Movement) is growing...

Sam Bradford is not and never was Tua.  No comparison.  Tua put up 2 of the 3 highest QBRs in college football history in his 2 seasons as a starter.  That's elite.

You go ahead and draft another garbage QB to add to the decades-long list the Dolphins have assembled.  Me, I'll draft the elite prospect and take my chances.

The Anti-Tua Movement is made up of people that are afraid to take chances, and afraid to chase greatness.  That's a great way to fail.

CarsonChris wrote:The fact Mr Glass hasn’t made it through any football season since his days in high school  is a major red flag. 3rd round pick, sure, all over it.

rightchea wrote:
Tua played 2 years and has had three injures, yeah he has the ability to be great which I am not doubting at all but durability is everything.

If you're going to count minor ankle injuries, then you must be glad the Phins don't have Mahomes. He missed 2 games with an ankle injury this season. I wonder if the Chiefs are going to put him on the trade block now???

Sarcasm aside, the ankle injuries are NOTHING, and in fact Tua had tightrope surgery this season to ensure that it won't happen again. The ONLY injury that matters is the hip, and it is now a non-issue. He has been cleared to play and he's good to go.

Again, ALL QBs get hurt - it's part of the game.

CarsonChris wrote:If we draft Mr Glass we need a good back up and an even better line.

If we draft any QB to be the starter, we need a good backup and a good line. All part of being a strong team.

rightchea wrote:Draft Tua and Cole McDonald. Trade away Rosen and keep Fitz as leader for both of those young guys.

Sign me up!

rightchea wrote:Thoughts......

Interesting discussion about Herbert and Love.

My main issue with Herbert is that he doesn’t seem like a winner. He has a tendency to choke in big spots, and he isn't the type of QB that can take over a game and will his team to victory. I watched a ton of his games this season because I really wanted him to be "the guy"...instead, to me he looked like just another guy. For a QB with so much arm talent, he's really a very boring, by-the-book passer. He doesn't have that "attack" personality, and when his first option is covered he looks lost. He also has poor footwork, which leads to off-target passes and mistakes. I've seen too many passes to open receivers that are thrown off the mark. Herbert has the skillset to get better - much better - but does he have the personality to be an alpha? I don't see it, at all. I think what you'll get is a good solid QB that sometimes makes the playoffs, but never gets to the Super Bowl.

Love was as good a QB as you'll see in 2018, but regressed big-time in 2019 under a new coaching staff and losing almost all his offensive starters from the previous year. That's a concern...does he need everything to be perfect around him to succeed? But, he throws a gorgeous ball and is a true playmaker. If a play breaks down he has the ability to get out and make something happen, and he can throw the ball at multiple angles like Rodgers and Mahomes. Love has special skills, but like Herbert he needs to learn to read defenses.

Overall, I think the two QBs are very close. Both have enormous talent and big flaws. The main difference I see is that Love has
special playmaking ability that Herbert just hasn't displayed. That's why I'd take Love over Herbert...I've had enough of wishy-washy, uninspiring QBs in Miami.

finfanatic wrote:Calling Tua's injury history a non-issue is a non-starter IMO.

It is an issue. It is a big issue!

The questions is...is it a big enough issue to pass on drafting him if the Phins get the shot?

The next questions is... is it a big enough issue when his overall talent WITHOUT the injury would warrant trading up to get him?

Seems like Rivera is thinking some teams are gonna desire Tua and think the Phins are going to grab him at #5, so he is laying it on heavy about drafting a QB hoping some team will pull a "Jeff Ireland" and panic and trade up and end up giving up far too much to do it. Or was that Spielman???? Maybe both?  

On the drafting injured players, I have one response that should make all Phin Phans curse: Yatil "Ouch! My Knee" Green!!!

I am gonna leave this up to Grier and Flores. If they want Tua, so be it. It is not going to be my job that gets axed if he is "Mr. Glass"!

The hip was a big issue. It isn't any longer. Sure, you worry about what could happen in the long-term because you just don't know, but all reports are that he'll be fine. The key here is that he has already been cleared for practice, and he came through the extensive medical poking and prodding at the Combine with flying colors. Once he dominates his Pro Day, the injury becomes a non-factor. And, his leadership ability/personality/attitude are off the charts. This is the type of player you want leading your franchise - he's the total package.

finfanatic wrote:Well, you and Charlie Weiss agree, JMP. I heard him say he might go for Tua at #1 overall even if Burrows is there.  Assuming of course, the whole hip injury thing is behind Tua.

Weiss also said Hurts is this year's Lamar Jackson!

So if Burrows and Tua are gone, could the Phins get Hurts with their second 1st rounder? Especially if Herbert, Love, Eason are taken ahead of Hurts?  But if another teases Hurts as this year's Lamar Jackson, I doubt Hurts will be there.

All things being equal, I have Tua over Burrow as well. But I think Burrow may be a better fit for the Bengals, given his style of play and the fact that he's from Ohio. But really, I think you can't go wrong either way - both are excellent prospects and are clearly the 2 best QBs, however you want to rank them head to head.

As far as Hurts, he's not as fast or athletic as Jackson - but I'm thinking he may be a better passer. I wasn't convinced that Hurts was a legit NFL QB at first, but I've been looking into him more and I see that I was wrong...he looks like he could be the real deal. He's definitely raw, but at the Combine he showed that he is willing to work hard and work on his technique. I was very impressed with his work at the Combine. Not sure where he goes in the draft...maybe late first??

On another note...

I had been a big fan of Iowa DE A.J. Epenesa and was hoping the Phins would draft him.  But he ran a 5.0 40 at the Combine - that's a brutal number.  He's big and strong and was great at both rushing the passer and defending the run at Iowa.  Looks like a perfect fit for the Dolphin D.  But that 40 time...scary!  Curious to see what he runs at his Pro Day.

I think I'd still pull the trigger on him at 26, or the first pick in round 2, because this draft class looks weak for high-end pass rushers and he does seem like a great match for Miami.

rightchea wrote:I think they had put him in the low first early second after the combine.

yeah, that sounds right when you look at his production in college - 22 sacks and 8 forced fumbles over the last two seasons. And he's 6'6", 275...exactly what you want in a 3-man front.

CarsonChris wrote:Wonder if Epenesa will run at his pro day and try to improve those numbers?  Does his film show something more than his straight line time?

I think he has no choice - he has to run at the Pro Day to improve that time.

I watched a few Iowa games and I can't say that speed ever seemed like an issue, but I also wasn't watching him for speed. He is a big boy, so he's not going to run a 4.5 or anything like that. 22 sacks and 30 tackles for loss in 2 years would seem to indicate that he's fast enough, but man, 5.0 is death for a DE! Very curious to see where he ends up going.