Phins hire new OL coach: Butch Barry

Butch Barry is the new Dolphins OL coach. 42 years old. He was the Broncos OL coach this season before getting fired with Hackett and other staff. In 2021 he worked with McDaniel as the assistant OL coach with the Niners. He was the Miami Hurricanes OL coach in 2019.

I don't know much about him, but I do know I wasn't happy with the Canes OL in 2019...but then again I could say that every year with UM! LOL

This is encouraging:

Chris Kouffman
@ckparrot

Of particular note is that in 2021 the Denver Broncos ranked #15 in Team Run Block Win Rate and #16 in Team Pass Block Win Rate.

Their rankings improved under Butch Barry from #16 to #9 in Team Pass Block Win Rate, and from #15 to #4 in Team Run Block Win Rate.

That's a pretty significant improvement from one year to the next. Let's hope Barry can do something similar for the Phins!

Now, I did hear that Broncos players were happy when Barry got fired...so that's not good. But from what I see, its sounds like the Broncos OL was built for man blocking while Barry was implementing a zone scheme...so there may have been a disconnect between coaching and players. That aspect of it won't be an issue in Miami, where Barry will run the San Fran zone scheme that the Phins ran this season.

Overall, it seems like an under-the-radar hire of a young coach that has experience with McDaniel's scheme. Not a home run on the surface, but we'll see. I had hoped for a more experienced OL coach, but I'm willing to give McD the benefit of the doubt based on the 2022 season.

I don't like this at all Just another "I used to work with this guy" hire that every NFL head coach predictably makes. You can forget about the O-line getting any better now Hell, Dave Barry probably would've been better!

DolFan 316 wrote:I don't like this at all Just another "I used to work with this guy" hire that every NFL head coach predictably makes. You can forget about the O-line getting any better now Hell, Dave Barry probably would've been better!

Dave Barry rules!!

Based on OL stats from multiple sources, it seems like Denver's OL was very good last season, despite dealing with multiple key injuries and a QB that held the ball forever. So I'm willing to give this guy a shot. He knows the system so that alone is a huge step in the right direction.

Analytics numbers is like everything else the media spews out these days as 'truth". It completely contradicts what your own senses are telling you. I prefer numbers like scoring (Broncos were dead last) and sack percentage. Sack percentage is real easy to figure out. Just add a team's pass attempts + sacks allowed and divide the sacks allowed by that number. For a guideline, the league average last season was 6.7. 8-10 is very bad. 10 or more is abysmal. This gives more context to sacks allowed. For example, if 2 teams both allowed 35 sacks in a season but Team A had 100 more pass attempts, then they'd clearly be better at pass blocking.

The Fins had the 10th lowest sack percentage last season at 5.7 (rounding for simplicity). This includes Bridgewater getting sacked on 8.1 % of his dropbacks    Both Tua and Skylar's sack percentage were under 5.5. HOWEVER...only two teams had a worse sack percentage than the Broncos' 9.9.

https://stathead.com/tiny/dKXw5

https://stathead.com/tiny/ripKe

As far as yards per carry the Broncos were better...slightly. They finished 17th in that category to the Fins' 19th (Fins had one more rushing TD). So okay, their line was at least as good run blocking. But McDaniel doesn't like to run so if the hire was based on that then in a way it's even more nonsensical. And then there's the whole "dead last in scoring" thing. How does that happen with a so-called vastly improved O-line? But hey, Chase Edmonds (remember him?) did average 2 more yards per carry after being traded to Denver so there's that. I swear, if that turns out to be the main or only reason Barry was hired...

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/E/EdmoCh00.htm

At some point you'd think somebody would figure out that the problem isn't the O-line coaches who get fired every year, it's the players brought in by the GM who's been around through multiple head coaches, and the scouting staff who keeps recommending these players.

Yeah, I am gonna reserve judgement on this, but...

On the surface it does not look "too effin' good!!"

We saw Dumbarse Dave Dumbstedt dump coaches who called him on his asinine decisions in favor of toadies and buddies and friends who would toe the company line.

I sincerely hope this is not what McD is doing.

We shall have to see, but... If what I read is true(??), the is no way no how Barry should be a coach in the NFL; he was leaving notes in Oline players lockers giving them criticism without correction... instead of face to face confrontation.

Butch Barry

Some interesting reports coming out about former Denver Broncos offensive line coach Butch Barry after he was hired by the Miami Dolphins on Wednesday. It appears he wasn’t well-liked by the players in the locker room and they applauded when his firing was announced by Interim head coach Jerry Rosburg during a team meeting.

On the face of it, it would seem concerning that players were so openly hostile to a member of the coaching staff. However, Benjamin Allbright added some more context to the apparent dysfunctional coaching style Nathaniel Hackett had in place with some of his staff. Butch Barry would allegedly leave notes in player lockers, instead of having face-to-face conversations.

The situation devolved to the point where many players felt like Barry had no idea what he was doing.

Maybe it was the scheme difference like JMP is suggesting, but... leaving freakin' notes in a locker!!! If that is true I wouldn't hire him to be a ball boy!!

I will give Him a Pass for Now since don't know much about the Dude. Heard Broncos OL was Happy he was Fired since he was a Note Leaver wouldn't criticize You to your Face showing No Backbone. If True that will have to Change in order to be successful need to have Strong Communication skills for success.

DolFan 316 wrote:Analytics numbers is like everything else the media spews out these days as 'truth". It completely contradicts what your own senses are telling you. I prefer numbers like scoring (Broncos were dead last) and sack percentage. Sack percentage is real easy to figure out. Just add a team's pass attempts + sacks allowed and divide the sacks allowed by that number. For a guideline, the league average last season was 6.7. 8-10 is very bad. 10 or more is abysmal. This gives more context to sacks allowed. For example, if 2 teams both allowed 35 sacks in a season but Team A had 100 more pass attempts, then they'd clearly be better at pass blocking.

The Fins had the 10th lowest sack percentage last season at 5.7 (rounding for simplicity). This includes Bridgewater getting sacked on 8.1 % of his dropbacks    Both Tua and Skylar's sack percentage were under 5.5. HOWEVER...only two teams had a worse sack percentage than the Broncos' 9.9.

https://stathead.com/tiny/dKXw5

https://stathead.com/tiny/ripKe

As far as yards per carry the Broncos were better...slightly. They finished 17th in that category to the Fins' 19th (Fins had one more rushing TD). So okay, their line was at least as good run blocking. But McDaniel doesn't like to run so if the hire was based on that then in a way it's even more nonsensical. And then there's the whole "dead last in scoring" thing. How does that happen with a so-called vastly improved O-line? But hey, Chase Edmonds (remember him?) did average 2 more yards per carry after being traded to Denver so there's that. I swear, if that turns out to be the main or only reason Barry was hired...

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/E/EdmoCh00.htm

At some point you'd think somebody would figure out that the problem isn't the O-line coaches who get fired every year, it's the players brought in by the GM who's been around through multiple head coaches, and the scouting staff who keeps recommending these players.

The Broncos offense was a total shitshow, due in large part to Hackett, who had no idea what he was doing. And even with that, the Broncos were #9 in pass block win rate and #4 in run block win rate...two of the most important statistical measures for OL. And that's with major injuries along the OL.

Sack numbers are hard to evaluate because you'd have to look at each sack to see whose fault it was - it could be the OL, a RB, TE or WR, or the QB. I do know this: Russell Wilson routinely gets sacked over 40 times a season, and I doubt that's all on his OL every single season. I also know that Tua gets the ball out super-fast, and doesn't get sacked a lot, despite having an OL that gives up lots of pressure.

Time will tell what type of coach Barry is, but looking inside the numbers I'd say he did a solid job last season, and he has already worked with McDaniel in the same exact offense.

BTW - lots of coaches leave notes in lockers, usually with things to focus on, inspirational quotes, etc. My junior high baseball coach (who was a long-time football coach) used to do that, with notes about visualizing yourself making a play and stuff like that. Without context to this Barry story, we don't know what the notes in question were about. But I don't believe for a second that he was criticizing players in the notes - I call BS on that.

As for the Broncos players applauding coaches getting fired...after that garbage season they had I'm not sure they should be applauding anything. Sounds a case of like modern-day spoiled athletes to me, that fail to take responsibility for anything.

If Barry is good enough for Shanahan and McDaniel, I'm 100% willing to give him a chance. Shanahan's track record with coaches speaks for itself, and after one season McDaniel has assembled a great staff himself. But I guess we live in a world where it's easier to shit on everything than it is to give something a chance.

Probably some disappointment across the fan base that hopes for Munchak did not come to fruition. And that would have been a home-run hire.

Clearly a junior coach, our OC will most likely continue to spend time working with the OL room. That's fine, if that's the expectation. Which it probably is since it's very clear this is not a veteran OL coach.

We don't know all going on behind the scenes in Miami, let alone Denver. Firing Applebaum is a strong sign he wasn't delivering what McDaniel, Smith and the staff wanted from him. Hopefully Barry will do whatever was not getting done last season. Otherwise, we will be looking for another OL coach next season.

I'm not encouraged or discouraged by this hiring. We're now talking about lower-level assistants. Granted, it's the offensive line and it seems like we talk about that unit EVERY year, but still. We have strong leaders at head coach, offensive coordinator and defensive coordinator. It should not be difficult to put an effective staff in place around them.

white1 wrote:Probably some disappointment across the fan base that hopes for Munchak did not come to fruition.  And that would have been a home-run hire.
 

I read that Munchak uses more of a man blocking scheme, so that would not fit with the Dolphins' offensive system.

white1 wrote:

I'm not encouraged or discouraged by this hiring.  We're now talking about lower-level assistants.  Granted, it's the offensive line and it seems like we talk about that unit EVERY year, but still.  We have strong leaders at head coach, offensive coordinator and defensive coordinator.  It should not be difficult to put an effective staff in place around them.
 

Agreed, and well said!

Two funny things about the "Broncos insider" that reported Broncos players cheered when Barry got fired:

1. This "insider" said that Barry was fired at midseason. In fact, he was fired after week 17.
2. This "insider" also said that Barry was fired by the interim head coach (which, of course, doesn't match the timeline of Barry supposedly being fired at midseason!) In fact, Barry (along with the STs coach) was fired almost immediately after Hackett got fired. I'd also add that I've never heard of an interim HC having the power to fire anyone.

All this to say that if this "Broncos insider" is lying about when and how Barry was fired, maybe he's also lying about the players applauding after the firing. I'm really sick of this social media crap where a so-called "expert" can just spew blatant lies and people just eat it up and spread it as fact.

JMP wrote:Sack numbers are hard to evaluate because you'd have to look at each sack to see whose fault it was - it could be the OL, a RB, TE or WR, or the QB.  I do know this: Russell Wilson routinely gets sacked over 40 times a season, and I doubt that's all on his OL every single season.

I was anticipating this response and had a counter at the ready. Wilson's career sack rate is in fact on the high side at 8.5%. Last season it was 10.2%. After being considerably lower than that the previous two seasons in Seattle, a team hardly known for their outstanding O-lines at that time.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/W/WilsRu00.htm

I repeat, the Broncos' O-line under Barry got Wilson sacked even MORE than usual!

Is Tua totally terrified and trembling in terror? Because he probably should be.

My contention is that the ONLY reason the O-line improved from "worst in the league for years" to merely bad this season is due to Grier FINALLY bringing in two good players in Williams and Armstead while Hunt became his one draft acorn the blind squirrel found. So naturally the coach was fired and the new guy seems to be worse but people are saying he's better based on random metrics like "win rate" even they don't really know the meaning of while the team he was on scored the league's fewest points! SMH.

I do agree with Jmp on one thing--people constantly referring to themselves as "experts" when they're not. Like, for example, most of the analytics community.

I also notice Merc has been quiet about this. That can't be good...

Well, if you want to look at sack numbers, the 49ers allowed just 33 sacks in 2021 when Barry was an assistant OL coach there - so there's that.

Bottom line: in just one season McDaniel took the Dolphins from one of the worst offensive teams to top 10, and turned Tua from a punchline to one of the top QBs in the league. At this point, I'll give McD the benefit of the doubt with an offensive coaching hire - he's earned it.

JMP wrote:Well, if you want to look at sack numbers, the 49ers allowed just 33 sacks in 2021 when Barry was an assistant OL coach there - so there's that.

Bottom line: in just one season McDaniel took the Dolphins from one of the worst offensive teams to top 10, and turned Tua from a punchline to one of the top QBs in the league.  At this point, I'll give McD the benefit of the doubt with an offensive coaching hire - he's earned it.

Did McDaniel know what he was doing when he hired Applebaum? Just sayin'.

Also, in 2021 the 49ers' sack percentage was 6.0. The Fins' putrid pack of pansies had a sack percentage of...6.1. Still not making much of a case for Barry. If anything it makes more of a case for Tua's ability to avoid sacks better than most QBs (4.9 in '21, 5.0 this season). Which he'll need if Barry's past pass protection performances are any indication.

https://stathead.com/tiny/IcVts

More Stuff I read sounds like the Broncos Insider just didn't like Barry and decided to Bad Mouth him for some Reason.

All I know for sure is we have a guy with two first names and a guy with a french last name heading up the worst unit on the Miami Dolphins!

A unit that has LONG been one of the reasons the Phins never get over the hump.

At some point, as DF316 says, maybe SOMEONE needs to look at the main cause of the Phins dreadful Oline units??? Namely Grier. Maybe give BB and Jeanpierre (add in McD too I guess) a veto on every Olineman Grier tries to pick and the ability to choose an alternative Olineman?

One of the main pillars upon which rest The Phins hopes for a long playoff run is a unit head by BB and Jeanpierre!



I am going to give McD the benefit of the doubt, but... as I said, this does not look good on the surface. A nice free agent signing at RT or C or OG, and then a good cheap Olineman in the draft and maybe that will make BB and Jeanpierre's job much easier.

DolFan 316 wrote:

Did McDaniel know what he was doing when he hired Applebaum? Just sayin'.

Yep - the OL clearly improved under Applebaum. But McD wasn't happy with just being "better", so he's adding a guy with experience in the exact system he runs.

DolFan 316 wrote:I also notice Merc has been quiet about this. That can't be good...

sorry, been away in a secret locale with very little secure internet access.

but yes, you are right, based on his history this hire didn't thrill me. but i will say, if the things i've heard about Applebaum are true, he had to go. apparently there were a lot of missed assignments on the o-line and it was a result of Applebaum not being as versed in the scheme as he should've been. perhaps not his fault, considering he'd never run a wide zone blocking offense on the pro level.

if nothing else, as JMP has pointed out, at least Barry has experience in the scheme. that's got to make him a modicum of an iota slightly better - right...right...its gotta, just gotta. as to whether his former players like him or not - he's not being hired to be their friend, he's hired to coach and teach them the scheme.

we'll just have to file this away in the "wait and see" category for now. maybe there just wasn't anybody better available right now.

apparently there were a lot of missed assignments on the o-line and it was a result of Applebaum not being as versed in the scheme as he should've been. perhaps not his fault, considering he'd never run a wide zone blocking offense on the pro level.

Interesting insight. Yeah, if the coach isn't a scheme expert that players can rely on for answers and training on the assignments.... doesn't make much sense to retain him.

I bet Butch nips these missed assignments in the bud with a few well-written and timely sticky notes stuck in the Olinemen's lockers!!!





Sorry. Couldn't resist.

finfanatic wrote:I bet Butch nips these missed assignments in the bud with a few well-written and timely sticky notes stuck in the Olinemen's lockers!!!





Sorry. Couldn't resist.