Justin Herbert

Herbert gets his second start of the season this year. He looked great bin the limited highlights I watched. At the end of this game it will be clear he should be SanDiegos starter but Tyrod gets the starts because of PC pressure from within the league.

He has a great arm but he made a classic Herbert mistake that cost his team the game: threw an INT directly to the other team when he instead should have ran for the first down with no one in front of him. I've seen him make poor decisions like that over and over at Oregon.

Bottom line for me: he's going to be good and will be a long-time starter, but I think his accuracy and decision-making are always going to be a concern. I think he's sort of a lesser Phillip Rivers in terms of skillset, but lacking the fire and leadership that Rivers has. Like Rivers, I see a lot of TDs and a lot of turnovers in Herbert's career.

Tyrod has a punctured lung so he might not be starting any time soon, depending on recovery time. Herbert should be able to steal the job with some solid performances. Herbert seems like a good dude - I hope he succeeds.

San Diego coaching lost that game with some of the most Marty-ballish stuff I've seen in quite awhile. They were so conservative, they made Mitch McConnell look like a card-carrying Bolshevik by comparison.

Herbert was fine. Not great, fine. He made a rookie mistake here and there, but really I was impressed considering he took no snaps with the first team offense and was handed the keys between warmups and the kickoff.

JMP wrote:He has a great arm but he made a classic Herbert mistake that cost his team the game: threw an INT directly to the other team when he instead should have ran for the first down with no one in front of him. I've seen him make poor decisions like that over and over at Oregon.  

Bottom line for me: he's going to be good and will be a long-time starter, but I think his accuracy and decision-making are always going to be a concern.  I think he's sort of a lesser Phillip Rivers in terms of skillset, but lacking the fire and leadership that Rivers has.  Like Rivers, I see a lot of TDs and a lot of turnovers in Herbert's career.

Tyrod has a punctured lung so he might not be starting any time soon, depending on recovery time. Herbert should be able to steal the job with some solid performances.  Herbert seems like a good dude - I hope he succeeds.

This is gonna be a learning curve for Herbert. Knowing when to make the right decision and not feel the pressure> I thought that Herbert might have been a better option for Miami but I not sure if Miami could teach him how to make good decision with the OL that Miami has

Herbert played his best game yesterday. Still threw an ugly INT, but the TDs were great. I like how the Chargers are giving him mostly safe throws, but at the same time they aren't afraid to let him air it out. Off to a strong start to his career.

Joe Burrow is also playing well - got his first NFL win yesterday!

Fast forward one year...

Herbert looks like a different player compared to last season.  He's got so much confidence right now...you can see his whole demeanor has changed.  He's showing leadership ability, and he's avoiding the mistakes that have plagued him since Oregon.  It helps that SD has a great OL, strong running game and two excellent receivers, but man, I am impressed by Herbert's maturity and progression.  Good for him.

I'm impressed you're not rooting for him to fail so that Tua can look better. Seriously.

But this narrative that everybody "knew" Herbert would be good before the 2020 draft is utterly false. He never would've lasted until the 6th pick if that was the case.

Herbert and Josh Allen completely changed how I evaluate QBs out of college. I used to think accuracy was the number one attribute in terms of passing a QB needed in order to succeed in the NFL. Now I realize that great accuracy starting out is the least important thing and can be coached up, and what's really needed is to be big, strong-armed, and the ability to run. Everything else takes care of itself if a QB has the physical attributes. (Guys like Kyler Murray aren't big, but they still have strong arms and running ability.)

As far as leadership, that's not as important as it used to be either, because nobody these days even knows what leadership is. "Leadership" equals "playing well and winning most of the time". Period.

DolFan 316 wrote:I'm impressed you're not rooting for him to fail so that Tua can look better. Seriously.

I would never do that.  I call it like I see it, always, and I'm not afraid to change my opinion if what I see warrants it. 

I wouldn't compare Herbert and Tua anyway...two very different types of QBs, in two very different situations.

Bottom line, the Chargers have found their guy for the next decade.

We are still looking, IMO.

Thing is, Herbert would be a disaster on this Dolphins team. Could you picture him behind this crappy OL??? He'd probably have 3 TDs and 10 INTs this season...the Phins would have destroyed him. Fortunately for him, he's in a perfect situation with the Chargers. He should pray every night to give thanks for avoiding this dumpster fire.

It helps that SD has a great OL, strong running game and two excellent receivers, but man, I am impressed by Herbert's maturity and progression.

Keep in mind, they build this OL with two key moves - last year they were not that good (witness their game against us). Adding FA Linsley at Center, and drafting Rashawn Slater made a world of difference.

Wow, so that's how a franchise solves a problem? Interesting....

Linsley and Slater? You mean the two players Grier had a chance to draft and sign, but refused to? Those guys?

(Facepalms.)

white1 wrote:

It helps that SD has a great OL, strong running game and two excellent receivers, but man, I am impressed by Herbert's maturity and progression.

Keep in mind, they build this OL with two key moves - last year they were not that good (witness their game against us).  Adding FA Linsley at Center, and drafting Rashawn Slater made a world of difference.  

Wow, so that's how a franchise solves a problem? Interesting....

They also brought in a good coaching staff.

Crazy game for Herbert last night! Monster stat line - nearly 500 yards total, including 90+ rushing yards! He was great most of the game, then fell apart for awhile in the 4th quarter. On consecutive series late in the game, he missed a wide open receiver on the sideline, took an awful sack, and had a pass batted down that turned into an INT. Fortunately he followed that up with a 50+ yard TD to win the game, but man, what a roller coaster ride if you're a Chargers fan!

I'm actually really annoyed that the Herberts won. I as rooting for a loss because I felt that it would finally make people realize that for all his supposed superiority as a QB, Herbert's team would've only been a game and a half ahead of the supposedly awful Tua-led Fins. And Tua would have the head to head win last season. IMO it was a real chance for the narrative to start changing but the damn Steelers had to screw it up so now we get more Herbert media fellatio

BTW, it seems like Herbert gets a lot of passes batted down at the line.  316, can you find stats on batted passes?  Just curious to see numbers.

Couldn't find any stats but I did find this.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/49ers/article/Why-are-so-many-of-49ers-QB-Trey-Lance-s-pass-16546655.php

Trey Lance is 6-foot-4 and has thrown just 48 passes this season, but only one other NFL quarterback has had more passes batted down than the 49ers’ rookie.

Lance already has had five of his throws swatted away at or near the line of scrimmage, which is one fewer than the Chargers’ Justin Herbert, who has 246 attempts.

You're welcome

Thanks!

Interesting that taller QBs have trouble with batted passes, but shorter QBs like Brees, Tua and Murray don't seem to have that issue. Of course, as Dolfans we all remember that the 6'4" Ryan Tannehill was the king of batted passes.

That's an ugly percentage for Trey Lance...5 out of 48??? That's just over 10%!

JMP wrote:Interesting that taller QBs have trouble with batted passes, but shorter QBs like Brees, Tua and Murray don't seem to have that issue.

My guess would be that short QBs have spent years even before reaching the NFL learning little tricks to create throwing lanes for themselves, since no QB is going to throw a pass if he can't see where it's supposed to be going. Sliding/stepping to one side, throwing at various angles, etc. Taller guys never had to worry about that, so they pretty much just stand in one spot when they're about to throw.

DolFan 316 wrote:

JMP wrote:Interesting that taller QBs have trouble with batted passes, but shorter QBs like Brees, Tua and Murray don't seem to have that issue.

My guess would be that short QBs have spent years even before reaching the NFL learning little tricks to create throwing lanes for themselves, since no QB is going to throw a pass if he can't see where it's supposed to be going. Sliding/stepping to one side, throwing at various angles, etc. Taller guys never had to worry about that, so they pretty much just stand in one spot when they're about to throw.

Makes sense for sure!

Six weeks after my last post in this thread, and it now looks very possible that Cincy, Miami and the Chargers all connected with their top-6 QB picks last year. Very early, obviously, and none have made the post-season yet, but it isn't a foregone conclusion that Herbert is the best of the bunch or that Tua or Burrow can't be.

It is clear that both Burrow and Herbert have been given better help around them than Tua has up to this point.

Great post, Hal. I agree, and it is excellent news for the NFL - especially after seeing how the majority of this current draft class looks, and looking ahead to a seemingly underwhelming 2022 QB draft.