Tua arm strength

Someone please tell Tua's trainer that if they release a video of Tua throwing a small weighted ball 10ft as a demonstration of arm strength conditioning that it just adds more fuel to the fire of his lack of arm strength.

His PR people or lack of aren't helping him out!

Until the season starts and he does it on gameday it won't stop. The criticism is relentless.

Yep. My thinking is he will show it on the field this season, and that will only slightly lessen the howls of criticism against him.

For some reason, the league HATES Tua.

white1 wrote:Yep.  My thinking is he will show it on the field this season, and that will only slightly lessen the howls of criticism against him.

For some reason, the league HATES Tua.

The way the world is now, if Tua sexually assaulted multiple women the media would suddenly love him.

Well, the truth of the matter is that the QB who was selected right behind Tua is seen as a rising star in the league. You can talk about records all you want but Herbert has the stats where nobody questions his abilities. Given a better defense this season, I expect the Chargers to be formidable.

Tua, after three seasons with ToxicTeamKiller as his HC, is not seen that way. Let's face it, Tua has gone out there and laid a few eggs!

I truly hope this season will at least shut some of the doubters up. But until he actually performs at a high level this is what you can expect.

And even if the team is successful and Tua has good stats, my guess is his detractors will say it was all due to McDaniels.

But hopefully, after this season, we can all (or maybe just the majority of us)... all agree the Dolphins are set at QB.

That would make for a successful season IMHO.

Yep and I don't care if McDaniel DOES get the credit - success is success that's all I care about.

Eff the rest.

On Herbert BTW I do agree... one notable quote I remember from a veteran scout on Grier (and the entire FO) "they went into the process with the end already in mind, a fatal mistake". In other words, the evidence was there that Herbert would be better, but they chose Tua anyway.

Belichek, by the way, is being criticized for his drafts and the scouts over-emphasizing the pre-draft interviews with players. Sound familiar? So we LOVED Tua in the interview, while Herbert clearly put better NFL caliber skills on tape.

white1 wrote:In other words, the evidence was there that Herbert would be better, but they chose Tua anyway.  

So we LOVED Tua in the interview, while Herbert clearly put better NFL caliber skills on tape.

i don't agree with that. prior to the hip injury, there was no question Tua was the far superior QB. Herbert was a good (not great) QB with real questions about his leadership abilities - and that is exactly what he still is. my personnel opinion is that Herbert is at or very near his ceiling. he'll always be above average, but i am not convinced he'll take that next step.

Tua on the other hand, will get there. he had to overcome the injury, multiple unqualified offensive coaches and a HC that was downright undermining him - and still wasn't awful. he will now be brought along and developed as he should be and will respond accordingly.

Phins scout Marvin Allen recently discussed what the Dolphins saw in Tua...

“If you remember how Tua first came in for Alabama, he rescued them in the championship game. He showed all the poise, instincts, anticipation you would want to see.

He’s more of a leader by example, but he’s a cool, calm, collected customer. Some of the throws he’s been able to make with his anticipation and accuracy” left an impression on Dolphins management.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article260848157.html

finfanatic wrote:Well, the truth of the matter is that the QB who was selected right behind Tua is seen as a rising star in the league. You can talk about records all you want but Herbert has the stats where nobody questions his abilities. Given a better defense this season, I expect the Chargers to be  formidable.

Tua, after three seasons with ToxicTeamKiller as his HC, is not seen that way. Let's face it, Tua has gone out there and laid a few eggs!

I truly hope this season will at least shut some of the doubters up. But until he actually performs at a high level this is what you can expect.

And even if the team is successful and Tua has good stats, my guess is his detractors will say it was all due to McDaniels.

But hopefully, after this season, we can all (or maybe just the majority of us)... all agree the Dolphins are set at QB.

That would make for a successful season IMHO.

Herbert's pretty stats haven't equated to meaningful wins, so what's the point? Deshaun Watson tore up the league statistically in his final season and his team won 4 games. I've said it before: stats sure look nice, but if they don't lead to wins, who cares outside of fantasy football players?

Tua wins. I don't care if he doesn't have Hall of Fame stats...HE WINS. Now that he's healthy and has a real team around him, the stats will come. But I don't care about that...I care about WINS

I’m so Ready for Camp to Begin after 7 Months about Tua’s Arm .

Can Someone Please Shut Hill up , Tua has enough Pressure on Him and he is making it Worse not Better.

finskev wrote:Can Someone Please Shut Hill up , Tua has enough Pressure on Him and he is making it Worse not Better.

I'm fine with it. With all these analysts shitting on Tua every single day, it's good to hear someone saying positive things about him - especially a teammate.

white1 wrote:
In other words, the evidence was there that Herbert would be better, but they chose Tua anyway.  

That evidence never existed. Tua was one of the greatest college QBs of his era, and Herbert...wasn't. Herbert was a choke-artist in college, and so far I haven't seen anything different in the NFL. Tua has proven to be a winner - even when surrounded by crap.

That evidence never existed. Tua was one of the greatest college QBs of his era, and Herbert...wasn't. Herbert was a choke-artist in college, and so far I haven't seen anything different in the NFL. Tua has proven to be a winner - even when surrounded by crap.

Yes, I definitely over-shot on this comment.

I guess my point was aimed around projecting college talent to the NFL. Looking for elite traits and how that will translate to success at the next level.

Tua clearly has elite character and accuracy, and has also shown the ability to make clutch plays under pressure - witness the college championship game.

Herbert has excellent size and elite arm strength. Questions around his leadership ability and the ability to be "clutch".

I get your point about winning, but I will counter that football is a team game. No quarterback (or very few, anyway) can "carry" a team on his own. Defense and special teams gaffes lose a lot of games in the NFL.

To me, it's clear that Herbert has demonstrated MORE QUICKLY his ability to succeed in the NFL.

Tua has shown he can win, the accuracy is still there, but concerns about his injury history and arm strength have not been silenced. Not YET. Of course I am hoping this happens, but at this point in time I have to say Herbert was the correct pick - and my critique of Grier is he went into the scouting process already decided.

I'm going to reiterate what I said prior to the draft. Everything that Hebert accomplished he did on his own. No QB camps. No private QB coach. Hebert's development was all him. Coming into the NFL he is getting the coaching he never had. The coaching that most of the top level QB prospects had since HS. He has the better physical attributes he just didn't have the coaching. This is why I saw him as the better prospect. To reach high level of play without the extra tutoring means he was special. He has just started scratching the surface of his capabilities.

Tua had it all. The camps, the coaching. He was at his peak in college. I viewed him as a great college QB but a second tier NFL prospect. He's not big. He's not fast. His arm doesn't wow. He won games playing with the most talented team in college football. Everyone wins games playing for Alabama.

I liked all three QB prospects. I still think 2020’s QB draft could rival 2004’s in time. That year there was no wrong decision to be made. Eli, Big Ben and Rivers made all three teams happy.

I’d say Cincy and LA are already happy. I think there’s a very good chance we will be too.

Tyreek Hill, who had two chunk plays on throws from Tua Tagovailoa.

On the first, Hill hauled in a 15-yard slant and scampered past defenders for a long gain, which might have gone a touchdown in a game.

On the second, Tagovailoa threw a beautiful 30-yard sideline completion to Hill. Tagovailoa later dropped a pinpoint pass downfield into the hands of Hill with two defenders in coverage.

Tagovailoa also completed a 15-yard pass over the middle to Jaylen Waddle.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article263696408.html

gosh, i sure do wish that pesky lack of arm strength would stop getting in the way...

mercury22nathan wrote:

Tyreek Hill, who had two chunk plays on throws from Tua Tagovailoa.

On the first, Hill hauled in a 15-yard slant and scampered past defenders for a long gain, which might have gone a touchdown in a game.

On the second, Tagovailoa threw a beautiful 30-yard sideline completion to Hill. Tagovailoa later dropped a pinpoint pass downfield into the hands of Hill with two defenders in coverage.

Tagovailoa also completed a 15-yard pass over the middle to Jaylen Waddle.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article263696408.html

gosh, i sure do wish that pesky lack of arm strength would stop getting in the way...

Tua is a non contact warrior. I'm glad he beat the fourth string DB's !

funny how a 5 second video on twitter from a workout with Tyreek last May meant the end of his career cause he had no arm strength, but dropping dime passes in training camp is now all of a sudden meaningless.

oh well. i get , i get. none of it means anything until the real bullets start flying - and i agree, but...

when Tua leads the Phins to the playoffs (yep, i said it) and Herbert is sitting at home in January again, i sure hope we can talk about how amazing his stats are again.

white1 wrote:
I guess my point was aimed around projecting college talent to the NFL.  Looking for elite traits and how that will translate to success at the next level.

A lot of GMs and coaches have lost their jobs because they fell in love with "traits". Sure, a big QB with a rocket arm is great - but the league is littered with QBs like that that never made it in the NFL. Physical traits are nothing without intangibles.

white1 wrote:I get your point about winning, but I will counter that football is a team game.  No quarterback (or very few, anyway) can "carry" a team on his own.  Defense and special teams gaffes lose a lot of games in the NFL.

To me, it's clear that Herbert has demonstrated MORE QUICKLY his ability to succeed in the NFL.

Absolutely - a QB needs a team to win. But at the same time, QBs are paid to win games. Has Herbert really demonstrated anything more than Tua to this point? Again, stats are great - but sooner or later Herbert needs to make those stats translate to wins. His career record is much worse than Tua's - and Herbert has been on far better teams.

white1 wrote:Tua has shown he can win, the accuracy is still there, but concerns about his injury history and arm strength have not been silenced.  Not YET.  Of course I am hoping this happens, but at this point in time I have to say Herbert was the correct pick - and my critique of Grier is he went into the scouting process already decided.

The correct pick for what? A team to miss the playoffs and have a losing record in 2 years? Again, Herbert has nice stats...but if the buck stops there, who cares? Herbert has won less with more, Tua has won more with less. I know what I'd rather have.

CarsonChris wrote:

mercury22nathan wrote:

Tyreek Hill, who had two chunk plays on throws from Tua Tagovailoa.

On the first, Hill hauled in a 15-yard slant and scampered past defenders for a long gain, which might have gone a touchdown in a game.

On the second, Tagovailoa threw a beautiful 30-yard sideline completion to Hill.  Tagovailoa later dropped a pinpoint pass downfield into the hands of Hill with two defenders in coverage.

Tagovailoa also completed a 15-yard pass over the middle to Jaylen Waddle.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article263696408.html

gosh, i sure do wish that pesky lack of arm strength would stop getting in the way...  

Tua is a non contact warrior.  I'm glad he beat the fourth string DB's !

He also beat Herbert head to head in a real game. Does that count?

mercury22nathan wrote:funny how a 5 second video on twitter from a workout with Tyreek last May meant the end of his career cause he had no arm strength, but dropping dime passes in training camp is now all of a sudden meaningless.

oh well.  i get , i get.  none of it means anything until the real bullets start flying - and i agree, but...

when Tua leads the Phins to the playoffs (yep, i said it) and Herbert is sitting at home in January again, i sure hope we can talk about how amazing his stats are again.    

Well said!

It's an entire new year and Tua has weapons he didn't have last year. I don't think he's a franchise QB but he could prove me wrong this year. So far I haven't seen it. Now or never though. He doesn't get another chance next year.

It's an entire new year and Tua has weapons he didn't have last year. I don't think he's a franchise QB but he could prove me wrong this year. So far I haven't seen it. Now or never though. He doesn't get another chance next year.

I can agree on that. It's not at all fair to Tua, given the absolute disaster on offense last season, but this is his career. He's got one more shot to prove he belongs and can be the face of the franchise. I'm really pulling for him.

CarsonChris wrote:It's an entire new year and Tua has weapons he didn't have last year. I don't think he's a franchise QB but he could prove me wrong this year. So far I haven't seen it. Now or never though. He doesn't get another chance next year.

Oh, he definitely gets another chance next season no matter what. He's on a cheap rookie deal and at the very least he gets a shot to compete.

All a moot point, though, because Tua will guide the Phins to the postseason this season - and once you're in, anything can happen!

Call me crazy, but I think Tua will be good enough that we'll be fighting for the division in that December 18 game at Buffalo. The winner of that game takes the East IMO.

But like everything else, we'll see!

BTW, from what I'm hearing, the chemistry starting to develop between Tua and Tyreek is getting downright scary. I heard that yesterday Tyreek went deep and two DBs had strong coverage over the top. Tua threw the pass underneath the coverage, allowing Tyreek to come back and make the catch. That's Aaron Rodgers-Davante Adams stuff right there! I can't wait to see how they continue to develop, along with Waddle!