I Blame Grier For This

I really do. Apparently nobody besides me noticed that Fangio's been saying for weeks now that he simply doesn't have the talent he needs to work with. ONE player from the last TWO drafts who looks like he'll amount to anything and the FA flops have been piling up too! I am now more convinced than ever that he's GOT to go!!!

This loss was not on Grier. It was on a defense that didn't make any adjustments and an offense that couldn't get out of it's own way.

Kohou had a terrible day. Frustrating because he's been excellent until today. I have to think either Apple or Smith could have helped. Ramsay would have for sure. Hopefully we will have those contributors back for the rematch along with Phillips.

HalCHorn wrote:Kohou had a terrible day.  Frustrating because he's been excellent until today.  I have to think either Apple or Smith could have helped.  Ramsay would have for sure.  Hopefully we will have those contributors back for the rematch along with Phillips.

By the time the rematch happens the Bills will have comfortably locked up the top seed and this team will be eliminated from the playoffs.

HalCHorn wrote:Kohou had a terrible day.  Frustrating because he's been excellent until today.  I have to think either Apple or Smith could have helped.  Ramsay would have for sure.  Hopefully we will have those contributors back for the rematch along with Phillips.

Yeah, as I've said, Kohou should not be a full-time boundary corner. He's much better as a nickle and dime slot. Apple is no savior, but there's no doubt in my mind he would have done a better job today. But really, why wasn't X on Diggs all day? Again, that wouldn't have solved the problem entirely, but the results would have been better.

DolFan 316 wrote:

HalCHorn wrote:Kohou had a terrible day.  Frustrating because he's been excellent until today.  I have to think either Apple or Smith could have helped.  Ramsay would have for sure.  Hopefully we will have those contributors back for the rematch along with Phillips.

By the time the rematch happens the Bills will have comfortably locked up the top seed and this team will be eliminated from the playoffs.

I don't see that happening at all. The Phins should absolutely be in the mix for a wildcard spot.

And it's a long season - Josh Allen is way overdue for an injury with all the hits he takes.

Oh I still think we can win the division. This was just one game. Matter of fact, I expect us to turn the tables on Buffalo and in the late season game and the division this time. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I think this team will improve as the season goes on.

HalCHorn wrote:Oh I still think we can win the division.  This was just one game.  Matter of fact, I expect us to turn the tables on Buffalo and in the late season game and the division this time.  If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I think this team will improve as the season goes on.

Just curious...what makes you think half the team won't be hurt (yet again) in another month, let alone the end of the season?

DolFan 316 wrote:

HalCHorn wrote:Oh I still think we can win the division.  This was just one game.  Matter of fact, I expect us to turn the tables on Buffalo and in the late season game and the division this time.  If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I think this team will improve as the season goes on.

Just curious...what makes you think half the team won't be hurt (yet again) in another month, let alone the end of the season?

I expect Fangio to get better with use of his personnel as time moves on, and more of that personnel to become available--he will have more confidence in Smith and Ramsay will be back then.  Yeah, it looks bad today.  But Buffalo laid a big egg the first game of the season too.  I mean, how do you lose to Rodgers-less Jests?  

We will recover and do fine.  I expect 11 or 12 wins.  If I'm wrong, feel free to remind me and let me have it in 3 months.

HalCHorn wrote:We will recover and do fine.  I expect 11 or 12 wins.  If I'm wrong, feel free to remind me and let me have it in 3 months.

I'll be way too depressed to do it by then. How about if I let you have it after they lose to the Panthers and/or Giants instead?

HalCHorn wrote:Oh I still think we can win the division.  This was just one game.  Matter of fact, I expect us to turn the tables on Buffalo and in the late season game and the division this time.  If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, but I think this team will improve as the season goes on.

Well, the schedule is favorable - with, amazingly, a good portion of our road games already played, and a lot of winnable games remaining. And the AFC East looks like just a two-team race.

We're not going anywhere till the D improves, though. It doesn't have to be great - just not godawful.

DolFan 316 wrote:

HalCHorn wrote:We will recover and do fine.  I expect 11 or 12 wins.  If I'm wrong, feel free to remind me and let me have it in 3 months.

I'll be way too depressed to do it by then. How about if I let you have it after they lose to the Panthers and/or Giants instead?

If THAT happens, feel free to!

JMP wrote:We're not going anywhere till the D improves, though.  It doesn't have to be great - just not godawful.

Again, it's my contention that it wasn't Boyer after all and it's not Fangio now, it's the players not being good enough. Period.

We're only just now finding this out because one, the Herberts choked as usual. Two, the Pats offense is mediocre at best. And three, when your own offense scores 70 it makes even a lousy D look good.

I don't agree at all. There's a lot of good players on this defense. It could be a scheme-fit issue, but the talent is there.

JMP wrote:I don't agree at all.  There's a lot of good players on this defense. It could be a scheme-fit issue, but the talent is there.

PFR doesn't think anybody on this D except maybe Howard is above average. This whole time I used to strongly disagree with them about that, especially Phillips and Holland. Now I'm not so sure they weren't right all along. Might as well move on from Wilkins if he can't make more of a difference than THIS.

I tend to agree on Wilkins. Nothing personal. But paying a DT elite money is a luxury for teams with a top ten defense.

If our defense needs more help DT is a bad place to spend. Spend at CB, pass rusher. Linebacker.

white1 wrote:I tend to agree on Wilkins. Nothing personal. But paying a DT elite money is a luxury for teams with a top ten defense.

If our defense needs more help DT is a bad place to spend. Spend at CB, pass rusher. Linebacker.

In the right system, Wilkins is a beast and worth every penny he'll get in free agency. But in this Fangio defense, he's been a complete non-factor.

JMP wrote:

white1 wrote:I tend to agree on Wilkins. Nothing personal. But paying a DT elite money is a luxury for teams with a top ten defense.

If our defense needs more help DT is a bad place to spend. Spend at CB, pass rusher. Linebacker.

In the right system, Wilkins is a beast and worth every penny he'll get in free agency.  But in this Fangio defense, he's been a complete non-factor.

All the other top paid DTs have at least one double digit sack season. Why can't Wilkins come close to doing it? He got outplayed by Ed Oliver today, who I already pointed out is where Wilkins' level really is--and Oliver's pay reflects that. Whoever pays Wilkins what he wants next season will be getting swindled big-time. A competent GM could draft a DT just as good next year.

Hoodwinked. Swindled, Betrayed, and belittled is how I feel today. The only positive out of this game is Achane is a good back! Tua wasn't good enough and the Bills are now 5-1 against Tua.

Also, Flores who's supposedly another defensive mastermind lost to this team 35-0 and 56-26. The players they have now simply are nowhere near good enough to make Josh Allen even break a sweat. Nowhere. Near. They got lucky that one time last season only because the Bills came in with a stupid game plan of limiting their own possessions and the Miami heat actually got to them for once. And even THEN they harked up 31 first downs and almost 500 yards!

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/202209250mia.htm

Again, it's my contention that it wasn't Boyer after all and it's not Fangio now, it's the players not being good enough. Period.

This is my take this morning after giving it some serious thought. The players we are familiar with, know and love, just aren't good enough. I watched Chiefs Jets last night and the NY defense had me green with envy (see what I did there). They pressured Mahomes, forced turnovers, dynamic, swarming to the ball. If they had a passable QB they win that game. With Rodgers, it may have been an absolute blowout.

Our roster on defense needs some serious rework. I don't view Wilkins as a must-have. What we need is a lot more speed and talent at LB and in the secondary.

Phillips obviously is hard for the Bills to handle and was missed. Kahou can play outside against a lot of WR's but not realistically against the Bills. Surely Cam Smith will be trusted and hopefully Ramsay will be back to help on Jan. 7th. Injuries are no excuse, I think Fangio was trying some things with what was available--just didn't work.

We had a bad day on offense too. Not Achane, who was a real bright spot, but this should put the kibosh on any record chasing or comparisons with the 1984 team for now.

Are people really forgetting how bad Boyer's defense was last season? It SUCKED, and his scheme was absolute garbage. Single coverage on the outside, with corners playing 10-15 yards off the receivers. Rush 7 or 8 to the QB, and allow the QB to throw first down after first down on underneath passes with no defenders in sight.

I'm not forgetting about Boyer JMP!

No. The problem IMO is we spent so much in draft picks/money on offense, that the defense is now undermanned. Jerome Baker is a great example, he's been here seemingly forever and I rarely see him make a game-impacting play...

white1 wrote:The problem IMO is we spent so much in draft picks/money on offense, that the defense is now undermanned.  Jerome Baker is a great example, he's been here seemingly forever and I rarely see him make a game-impacting play...

That was by necessity - this is an offensive-driven league, and our offense was absolute garbage. When McD took over, resources needed to be pumped into that side of the ball. In contrast, we actually did (and do) have some good players on D - but for whatever reason, they aren't producing.